This week on The One Thing podcast, our hosts, Robin Bettenhausen and Tom Kallai, spoke with two guests from Nonstop Health: Leslie Brown Albright, Director of Business Development, and Lori Hubler, Benefits Consultant. They dove deep into the topic of health equity and how Nonstop Health is driving positive change, particularly for lower-wage workers, through innovative solutions like first-dollar coverage.
Nonstop Health’s offers clients significantly reduced out-of-pocket costs to employees and big savings on insurance premiums, eliminating cost barriers to care. “Imagine knowing that your employer truly values your health – they’re removing the barrier that often keeps people from going to the doctor,” Lori said. “That changes everything.”
Throughout the conversation, Lori and Leslie shared insights from their experiences at various conferences and case studies that demonstrated the real-world impact of first-dollar coverage. One memorable example included an organization that saw significant savings in both premiums and out-of-pocket costs for employees.
They touched on how nonprofits, in particular, benefit from these programs, not only in reducing health care costs but in improving employee retention and morale. “We believe that everyone should have access to high-quality, affordable healthcare, whether you’re signing someone in the door or running the organization,” Leslie said.
The discussion also addressed skepticism around the program being “too good to be true,” with Lori reminding listeners that Nonstop Health’s approach is about empowering organizations: “Why pay the carrier for a richer plan design just in case your members use it, when you can internally pay yourself and turn it into a platinum plan?”
Leslie wrapped up by sharing the foundational values driving Nonstop Health: “We were born out of an agitation for the way lower-wage earning staff were able to access care… Our mission is to address health equity and humanity issues.”
Tune in to this episode to learn how Nonstop Health is disrupting the traditional health benefits system and advocating for equitable healthcare access, especially for nonprofits and underserved communities.
TRANSCRIPTION
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Hello and welcome back to The One Thing Podcast.
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I’m Robin Bettenhausen,
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and I’m here with my colleague Tom Kallai,
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and we are so excited to welcome to new guests.
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Today we have Lori Hubler
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and Leslie Brown Albright from Nonstop Health.
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Welcome ladies. Thank you so much for joining us.
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Thank you. Yeah, thanks for having us.
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I feel like every time I’ve spoken to you the last couple
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of months, you’ve been on a whirlwind sort of world tour,
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or at least US based tour at different conferences.
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So what was your favorite stop by far and why?
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Oh my gosh. Um, well, Lori
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and I recently went to, um, Sacramento
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and we were at, uh, one of the SHM conferences,
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and it was, it was great
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because we got to connect with employers, we got
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to see broker partners there.
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Um, just great engagement, uh, really good group.
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And um, you know, we just, we just like being
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around our people, so it was really lots of fun.
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I don’t know, Lori, I don’t wanna speak for you, but
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No, I agree. Um,
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and it was small, you know,
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sometimes we attend conferences that are just so huge
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and overbearing, and this one was a little bit small
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and I don’t know, just felt more homey. I guess
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California is not a bad place to be.
What is Health Equity?
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Well, I’m sure one of the things
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that you spoke about while at that conference
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and all of the others is a little bit about health equity.
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So I was hoping that we could start off by you telling us
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what is your definition of health equity
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and how does first dollar coverage from Nonstop Health
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really fit into that theme?
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Yeah, sure. I’ll go ahead and start us off.
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Um, so just kind of by definition, um, health equity is sort
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of the idea that everyone should have a fair
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and just chance to be as health as possible, regardless
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of factors like race, ethnicity, disability,
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sexual orientation, socioeconomic status, um,
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and first all coverage just means
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that a health insurance plan is gonna pay first, um,
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at nonstop health equity.
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It’s really built into our mission.
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It’s the core value of our company. I would say.
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Um, all of our programs are built with first dollar coverage
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because, um, you know, it’s been proven
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that cost is a barrier to care for lower wage earning staff.
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Um, Kaiser Family Foundation has a,
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a ton of research on this.
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I would really strongly encourage anyone, um, you know,
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that wants to dig into that,
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to check out some of their articles.
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Um, and you know,
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so we wanna eliminate that barrier to care.
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That’s why we’re doing what we’re doing.
Nonprofit Benefits Program & Employee Experience
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Um, we’re talking about people here
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and, you know, we believe that everyone should have access
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to high quality, affordable healthcare,
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whether you’re signing someone in the door that day
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or you’re running the organization.
62
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Um, we found that our solution
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and first dollar coverage can provide a better way
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of serving the needs of healthcare consumers through their,
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you know, employers
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and that we could really make this a real right
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and we can move the needle economically for employees
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and employers in a positive way.
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Um, so I would say that first dollar coverage in
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and health equity are sort
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of unwavering foundational building blocks
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for here, us here at Nonstop.
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I know you just mentioned that, you know,
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we’re talking about people
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and a lot of the clients that, that Robin
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and I work with are non-for-profits,
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and one of the ways that they attract people to come work
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with them is their benefits program.
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Yeah. So what, what is that employee experience
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with your program like, and,
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and what benefits do you see
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nonprofits see when they implement the program?
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Yeah, I’ll take that one, Leslie.
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Um, so first of all, we see a lot of different things.
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So the first thing is morale, right?
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We see that, um, one
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of the things within the organization
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is the morale just changes.
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Um, you know, I always think, imagine knowing
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that your employer truly values your health.
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Um, they’re removing the barrier
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that often keeps people from going to the doctor, right?
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Costs, um, come down.
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Um, you know, we know
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that’s the second largest spend really
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in most organizations.
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And so when the cost is, is beneficial to an employer
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and an employee does a lot for that as well.
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And then retention and recruitment is
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huge within the organization.
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I’ll just go back to we have a, um, a group
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pretty close to you guys.
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Life Unlimited, they’re not too far away.
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They’re in Missouri. They have about 240 employees.
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The marketing team recently did a case study with them,
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and they shared that the success
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by improving benefits helped them increase their retention
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rate to over 60%.
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So huge, um,
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win there when it comes to retention and recruitment.
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So that is really what we see.
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And then education, that’s another thing that we hear a lot
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of within the organization is just, um,
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how strong our education team is.
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We are there to help ease that burden for them,
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educate them on the program.
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We want them to be able to know how
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to use the program really well.
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Yeah. And just a quick follow-up question on that.
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What was it about first dollar coverage that drove the,
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the increase of 60% in retention?
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Yeah, so I mean, what really drove that was the fact
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that they were trying to increase their total comp package.
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Um, so, you know, they’re competing
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with large systems in the area.
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Um, these are direct support providers, um, you know,
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really tough work, very good work.
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Um, and the employer
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and the CEO there is is just phenomenal.
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I mean, just phenomenal.
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She has a whole structure where even her, um, her, uh,
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org chart has her at the bottom
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and the direct support providers at the top.
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So she really looks at it as serving the employees.
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And I think that the value, what I heard from, uh,
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from the HR team as well is just that people started
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to understand that, wow, this employer really values me.
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And, you know, they had other people asking them like, Hey,
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can I come work for you guys?
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You know, so they were actually getting in inquiries
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to come work for them because the,
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the benefits were so rich.
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Um, so it was a, it was a good, uh, point for us
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and a very proud moment for them when they sort of realized
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that they were really changing lives
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and the lives of people that were, you know,
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taking care of our loved ones.
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There’s something so powerful in that story, right?
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And in the message of, you pay for this benefit, we want you
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to use it, and therefore when you go, you’re not going
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to have to make decisions about do I fill this medication
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or do I pay rent?
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Or do I buy groceries that are giving,
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getting even more expensive?
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And I just love that that’s the message
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that we can bring to people.
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Mm-Hmm. And so, you know, I’ve worked
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with you on several different clients, um,
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and they seem to really love it.
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I think one of the interesting things is when we do open
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enrollment meetings, sometimes we’ll hear people say,
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you know, this seems too good to be true.
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Or an employer might say, well,
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why isn’t everyone doing this?
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So I’m sure you’ve heard those before as well.
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So how do you respond?
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Who’s a good fit, who might not be a good fit
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for a program like this?
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Yeah. Yeah. That’s a start. It’s such a good thing.
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I know, Lori, we, we just hear this so much.
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Um, I’ll, I’ll take the first part then, you know,
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of course I’m gonna pass it over to Lori to speak
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to who’s a good fit.
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Um, ’cause she’s truly our expert.
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Um, it’s too good to be true is, is one
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of our largest barriers that we actually face.
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Um, you know, people think we’re selling them a, a unicorn
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to fix a really serious solution.
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It’s the rising cost of health insurance premiums.
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I mean, everyone is,
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if you’re an employer, you’re talking about it.
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You’re looking at this every year.
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You’re faced with this in some regard.
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Um, and I think it could be really scary to trust something,
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you know, new and maybe new to the market.
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Um, you know, we, we’ve been working well for a long time,
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but we are new to some markets.
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Um, and, you know, they’re gonna try to trust something
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that’s gonna work within a damaged system.
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And, um, I think the other thing is that change is hard.
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You know? Um, it is a different way of looking at things,
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but I think that’s why, you know, we, we look
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to you guys like, you know, our broker partners
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to really vet us, um, alongside the client
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and really discuss with us openly whether
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or not this is going to be a good fit for them.
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Um, we, at nonstop, we’re really looking
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for true partnership from broker to employer
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to employee all the way through.
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Um, so that’s kind of my job really is
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to build trust across the country.
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Um, and lawyer and I are out there having
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conversations all the time.
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Um, but, you know, we respect
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that adapt adaptation can be slow.
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Um, but, you know, we aren’t going anywhere
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and we’re just gonna keep sharing our story.
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And, you know, having our clients,
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our happy clients share stories
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because truly, you know,
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they don’t wanna hear from us how great we are.
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They wanna hear from our clients how great we are.
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Um, so, you know, it’s, it’s a good thing.
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But, uh, Lori, do you wanna talk a little bit about fit?
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Yeah, of course. So you know it, you’re right Robin,
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it’s not a great fit for everybody.
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Um, the first thing with nonstop to be able
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to offer a program, we have
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to have at least 50 employees enrolled on benefits.
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So that’s the first place we start.
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Um, but we want employers who value good benefits, right?
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Um, not everybody does.
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And so those kind of clients
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that really value offering good benefits with
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that first dollar coverage, um, those are a great fit.
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Any groups that are on high level plans that re that need
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to reduce costs without lowering a benefit, right?
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Because we’re, we’re giving ’em that first dollar coverage,
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turning them into platinum plans.
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And then any groups out there that are really good fit
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for any kind of alternative funding, but are concerned
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or unable to take on, like the burden or the potential risk
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because we eliminate that risk
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for them to take on our model.
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Those are the real good fits for our, for our product.
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I know that there is a, a component to the program
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that has a Visa card.
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So could you explain kind of how
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that interacts with the program?
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And then also how do you prevent someone from using it in
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the wrong place or maybe using it on
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something that’s not approved?
00:10:23.695 –> 00:10:26.265
Good question. Um, so first of all,
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the co the cards come medically coded to only work for RX
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and Medical, and we completely align it
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with the underlining carrier plan that we’re wrapping.
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So very, very difficult for them to go
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and use it anywhere that’s not supposed to be used.
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It just won’t work. Um,
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we also manage all swipes on that card in-house.
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We have a whole member services team, so we kind
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of pride ourselves on our member experience.
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Um, we have a white glove substantiation process.
00:10:53.245 –> 00:10:56.025
We do not substantiate every single claim that is swiped on
00:10:56.025 –> 00:10:57.225
that card, but,
00:10:57.485 –> 00:11:00.665
but we can easily, um, red flag things
00:11:00.735 –> 00:11:03.345
that may look a little suspicious or off.
00:11:04.125 –> 00:11:07.145
Um, because really we are the fiduciaries on
00:11:07.145 –> 00:11:08.505
that employer’s money,
00:11:08.565 –> 00:11:10.785
and we really just wanna, we take that seriously
00:11:10.785 –> 00:11:13.225
and we wanna be, be the best fiduciaries of that money
00:11:13.725 –> 00:11:17.415
and have a member experience that, um, kind
00:11:17.415 –> 00:11:18.495
of mirrors that, right?
00:11:19.115 –> 00:11:20.855
So we can’t use it anywhere unfortunately,
00:11:21.475 –> 00:11:22.615
is what you’re saying, right?
00:11:22.635 –> 00:11:24.255
That’s by design, that’s
00:11:24.255 –> 00:11:25.335
Go out by airline tickets
00:11:25.475 –> 00:11:26.695
or anything like that with it now,
00:11:26.695 –> 00:11:27.695
Right?
Stabilizing Employer Health Insurance: A Case Study
00:11:27.795 –> 00:11:30.175
So we’ve talked over the last few minutes about
00:11:30.235 –> 00:11:32.055
how great this is for the member, right?
00:11:32.415 –> 00:11:34.135
Reducing their out of pocket first dollar
00:11:34.535 –> 00:11:35.735
coverage, love all of that.
00:11:36.195 –> 00:11:38.455
But I think employers are also gonna be wondering,
00:11:38.915 –> 00:11:42.215
is there a way that this hopefully reduces the long-term
00:11:42.385 –> 00:11:43.975
costs or our renewals,
00:11:43.975 –> 00:11:46.415
or what does it do for us in addition to
00:11:46.415 –> 00:11:47.815
how great it is for employees?
00:11:49.145 –> 00:11:50.715
Yeah. I’m gonna kick us off here.
00:11:50.715 –> 00:11:52.275
And, um, I love this question
00:11:52.275 –> 00:11:54.285
because sometimes we do get that, like,
00:11:54.385 –> 00:11:56.125
is this just a one year solution?
00:11:56.865 –> 00:11:58.765
And the answer is absolutely not.
00:11:58.975 –> 00:12:03.725
We’re looking to stabilize the employer’s,
00:12:03.865 –> 00:12:06.325
um, employee health insurance premiums.
00:12:06.325 –> 00:12:07.165
That’s what we’re trying to do.
00:12:07.165 –> 00:12:08.285
We’re trying to stabilize things.
00:12:09.105 –> 00:12:11.925
Um, and you know, I kind of said earlier that
00:12:12.585 –> 00:12:14.045
our clients tell our best story.
00:12:14.385 –> 00:12:16.365
And so I’m going to share just a,
00:12:16.525 –> 00:12:18.405
a small snippet of a case study.
00:12:18.905 –> 00:12:22.245
Um, you know, we have a large nonprofit,
00:12:22.645 –> 00:12:24.925
a community health center, in fact with, um, three,
00:12:24.925 –> 00:12:26.325
over 350 employees.
00:12:26.675 –> 00:12:28.805
They’re longstanding, client of ours been
00:12:28.805 –> 00:12:29.965
with us for about nine years.
00:12:30.115 –> 00:12:31.565
That came on in 2015.
00:12:32.385 –> 00:12:34.685
Um, and as of last year,
00:12:34.825 –> 00:12:36.805
we have saved the organization seven
00:12:36.865 –> 00:12:40.405
and a half million dollars in health insurance premiums.
00:12:41.105 –> 00:12:43.085
And this is the key component,
00:12:43.265 –> 00:12:46.965
nearly $935,000 in out-of-pocket costs
00:12:47.105 –> 00:12:48.605
for their employees.
00:12:49.185 –> 00:12:52.205
Wow. Um, those are impactful numbers, you know,
00:12:52.305 –> 00:12:54.725
and, uh, we are proud of those numbers
00:12:54.825 –> 00:12:56.765
and we’re excited that they’ve stayed with us as long
00:12:56.765 –> 00:13:00.525
as they have and we plan on continuing that relationship.
00:13:00.785 –> 00:13:02.925
And, um, you know, it’s, it’s, uh,
00:13:03.155 –> 00:13:04.805
it’s why we do what we do really.
00:13:05.625 –> 00:13:07.485
Um, but Lori, do you wanna kind
00:13:07.485 –> 00:13:10.045
of expand a little more on like the intricacies of,
00:13:10.145 –> 00:13:11.405
of how that kind of works?
00:13:11.715 –> 00:13:15.765
Yeah. So the whole idea, what behind our program is
00:13:15.765 –> 00:13:17.845
to be able to stabilize the increase
00:13:17.985 –> 00:13:19.925
to lower the percentage of renewals, right?
00:13:20.545 –> 00:13:23.365
Um, and kind of how this happens is, is
00:13:23.365 –> 00:13:25.205
with the way we build out our program,
00:13:25.915 –> 00:13:28.645
most folks aren’t even hitting the carrier plan.
00:13:29.105 –> 00:13:31.125
And so over time, less
00:13:31.125 –> 00:13:33.485
and less folks are actually even hitting the carrier plan,
00:13:33.485 –> 00:13:37.885
which in turn stabilizes that overall
00:13:38.885 –> 00:13:39.885
increase over time, right?
00:13:40.505 –> 00:13:42.645
Um, I always use the funny looking mole as an example.
00:13:42.785 –> 00:13:46.725
You know, if our whole goal, again is to allow folks
00:13:46.745 –> 00:13:47.845
to be able to seek services
00:13:47.865 –> 00:13:48.925
and get things taken care of,
00:13:49.445 –> 00:13:52.685
a $60 copay might not be a burden for you and I to go in
00:13:52.685 –> 00:13:54.285
and get something looked at or taken care of,
00:13:54.285 –> 00:13:57.045
but it could be for a frontline staff member working
00:13:57.065 –> 00:13:58.085
at a nonprofit, right?
00:13:58.545 –> 00:14:01.765
If we can just eliminate that one, she goes in, she’s able
00:14:01.765 –> 00:14:04.045
to get that taken care of, then maybe six months down the
00:14:04.045 –> 00:14:05.925
road, that person is not being treated for cancer.
00:14:06.145 –> 00:14:08.805
Mm-Hmm. Those large claims, those cancer things,
00:14:08.805 –> 00:14:10.085
those catastrophic things,
00:14:10.375 –> 00:14:12.005
those are gonna happen no matter what.
00:14:12.105 –> 00:14:14.285
And those are the things that affect the carrier plan,
00:14:14.665 –> 00:14:16.685
not the opting in to go get things taken care of.
00:14:16.685 –> 00:14:19.605
Mm-Hmm. So with our mission, if we can just eliminate one
00:14:19.605 –> 00:14:23.205
of those, what we see over time is we see that, um,
00:14:23.265 –> 00:14:26.405
really making an effect on that those carrier increases,
00:14:28.785 –> 00:14:30.455
Which everyone likes to see, right?
00:14:30.695 –> 00:14:33.335
I mean, we hate delivering bad news about increases
00:14:33.435 –> 00:14:35.655
and we want employees to use the benefit plan.
00:14:35.655 –> 00:14:37.535
That’s why it’s there, and that’s what they’re paying for.
Achieving Health Equity
00:14:37.675 –> 00:14:40.055
So, love all these examples that you shared.
00:14:40.295 –> 00:14:43.295
I think my last question for today is just
00:14:43.675 –> 00:14:45.455
how do you see nonstop health
00:14:45.975 –> 00:14:47.455
changing the healthcare landscape?
00:14:47.515 –> 00:14:49.055
And you’ve shared some really good examples.
00:14:49.115 –> 00:14:51.285
Is there anything else that you wanna leave our listeners
00:14:51.285 –> 00:14:54.445
with to understand why this program really matters,
00:14:54.815 –> 00:14:56.525
especially in the nonprofit space?
00:14:58.665 –> 00:15:03.275
Yeah. Um, you know, nonstop was created in 2012,
00:15:03.655 –> 00:15:04.875
um, with one mission,
00:15:05.375 –> 00:15:08.635
and that was to drive down the cost of health insurance
00:15:08.775 –> 00:15:10.555
for both employers and employees.
00:15:11.135 –> 00:15:13.155
And, you know, we know this is a really big statement,
00:15:13.295 –> 00:15:14.595
but, but we own it.
00:15:15.215 –> 00:15:18.755
Um, we were born out of an agitation
00:15:19.255 –> 00:15:21.635
for the way lower wage earning staff were able
00:15:21.655 –> 00:15:22.915
to access care.
00:15:23.535 –> 00:15:26.235
Um, our CEO was quite frankly, appalled.
00:15:26.815 –> 00:15:29.755
Um, and in his eyes, you know, he built this company
00:15:29.935 –> 00:15:32.875
to address health equity and humanity issues.
00:15:33.655 –> 00:15:36.755
And, uh, trust me, if you ever get the chance to meet David,
00:15:36.895 –> 00:15:38.915
um, there is no greater champion
00:15:39.015 –> 00:15:41.355
for people than David Slaves.
00:15:41.695 –> 00:15:43.675
Uh, it it’s pretty inspiring actually.
00:15:44.735 –> 00:15:47.555
Um, but you know, so basically he
00:15:47.655 –> 00:15:50.435
and our chief growth officer, Kristen Donahue, set out
00:15:50.435 –> 00:15:52.555
to build a workforce, um,
00:15:52.665 –> 00:15:55.555
that is absolutely comfortable disrupting the
00:15:55.555 –> 00:15:56.835
health benefits status quo.
00:15:57.415 –> 00:15:59.035
Um, we are proud of what we do,
00:15:59.615 –> 00:16:01.755
and I would say how it relates to nonprofits.
00:16:01.815 –> 00:16:06.595
You know, when we’re looking at the demo demographics of
00:16:06.615 –> 00:16:10.275
who makes up a typical nonprofit workforce, you know,
00:16:10.275 –> 00:16:13.115
we’re often talking about women and people of color.
00:16:13.735 –> 00:16:16.195
And you know, let alone when you combine the two of those,
00:16:16.215 –> 00:16:19.315
and you’re, you’re talking about black women in particular,
00:16:19.455 –> 00:16:23.035
the health disparity numbers are just absolutely staggering.
00:16:23.815 –> 00:16:26.715
And I would say for us as an organization, you know,
00:16:26.975 –> 00:16:30.955
we feel like it’s our mission to address these inequities.
00:16:31.935 –> 00:16:35.745
Um, and the last thing we want is
00:16:35.845 –> 00:16:39.265
for someone who’s working tirelessly, um,
00:16:39.405 –> 00:16:41.185
to make this world a better place
00:16:41.185 –> 00:16:44.585
through a nonprofit organization to have to decide,
00:16:44.645 –> 00:16:47.585
and Robin, you already said it, you know, to choose like,
00:16:47.585 –> 00:16:49.985
am I, am I going to put gas in my gas tank?
00:16:50.005 –> 00:16:51.425
Am I gonna put food on the table?
00:16:52.125 –> 00:16:53.505
Um, you know, or,
00:16:53.565 –> 00:16:55.505
or am I gonna go to the doctor to get
00:16:55.505 –> 00:16:57.145
that mold checked out that Lori talked about?
00:16:57.725 –> 00:17:00.745
Um, that choice is fundamentally wrong
00:17:00.805 –> 00:17:02.345
for people to have to make.
00:17:02.845 –> 00:17:06.225
Um, so we’re helping nonprofits with our solution
00:17:06.725 –> 00:17:09.985
by showing them the equitable benefits are possible, um,
00:17:10.015 –> 00:17:12.665
without damaging the nonprofit, um,
00:17:12.845 –> 00:17:14.305
or the employees financially.
00:17:14.885 –> 00:17:19.065
And we’re helping them uphold their missions of community
00:17:19.065 –> 00:17:20.385
and caring for people.
00:17:21.125 –> 00:17:23.625
Um, we just happen to be doing it
00:17:23.625 –> 00:17:25.025
through employee health benefits.
00:17:26.075 –> 00:17:28.485
Lori, how do you wanna expand on that a little bit?
00:17:29.285 –> 00:17:30.605
I, I think you nailed it, Leslie.
00:17:30.805 –> 00:17:32.285
I think you pretty much said everything,
00:17:32.305 –> 00:17:35.085
but kind of one thing that I’ll leave, it’s more
00:17:35.085 –> 00:17:37.765
of a thought and it came to mind when you were speaking,
00:17:37.865 –> 00:17:42.205
is I always just say that, that to nonprofits they just,
00:17:42.205 –> 00:17:43.725
just to be open-minded, right?
00:17:43.725 –> 00:17:45.645
Because sometimes again we go back to
00:17:45.645 –> 00:17:46.805
that this sounds too good to be true.
00:17:47.005 –> 00:17:48.245
I don’t understand it. What is this?
00:17:48.745 –> 00:17:50.325
And just to be really open-minded
00:17:50.715 –> 00:17:53.725
that it’s just a different way of purchasing healthcare
00:17:54.545 –> 00:17:57.205
to be able to give that health equity to your folks, right?
00:17:57.785 –> 00:17:59.805
Um, I always say, why pay the carrier
00:18:00.545 –> 00:18:02.125
for a richer plan design for the,
00:18:02.125 –> 00:18:05.605
just in case your members use it when you can internally
00:18:05.745 –> 00:18:06.925
pay yourself, right?
00:18:07.715 –> 00:18:10.325
Just because it’s a a less expensive healthcare plan,
00:18:10.575 –> 00:18:12.605
we’re turning it around into a platinum plan.
00:18:12.605 –> 00:18:14.685
Yeah. So that would be my final thought on that.
00:18:15.645 –> 00:18:17.565
I can’t think of two better guests for this year.
00:18:17.785 –> 00:18:20.325
Tom and I have really focused all of our communications
00:18:20.325 –> 00:18:23.045
that go out on a quarterly basis to be around health equity.
00:18:23.345 –> 00:18:25.605
So I was really looking forward to this conversation.
00:18:26.005 –> 00:18:28.005
I think there’s no better time to chat about it.
00:18:28.505 –> 00:18:31.205
And I wanna thank you for joining us on the One Thing
00:18:31.205 –> 00:18:33.085
podcast and we’ll talk again soon.
00:18:33.845 –> 00:18:34.945
Thanks so much. Thank you.
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